080610

SL Education Roundtable June 10, 2008 Open Forum

[15:26] Josh1 Sands: High School Seniors [15:26] AJ Brooks: evening everyone [15:26] Sarah Handschuh: Sorry if I missed something (I was busy with RL). Greowulf, are you happiest teaching online? [15:26] Josh1 Sands: hi AJ [15:28] AJ Brooks: feel free to come on down and have a seat - I'll be AFK for a minute, trying to get some group IMs sent out [15:28] Lette Ponnier: hello all [15:29] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: Hi, Lettie [15:29] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Is this the round table?? [15:29] Katya Anatine: Hi Lette, RubyTuesday [15:29] Lette Ponnier: hi richard and katya! [15:29] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: There's a round table down there on the stage [15:29] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: so, i'm in the right place! [15:30] Penelope Drucker: is it roundtable seating AJ? [15:30] AJ Brooks: yup [15:30] Penelope Drucker: how are you? [15:30] AJ Brooks: ok - done spamming groups with IM lol Hey Penelope, hows it going? [15:30] Fim Fischer: Hi everyone [15:31] Penelope Drucker: very well thanks [15:31] AJ Brooks: come on down and have a seat folks [15:31] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: This is the first round table I've attended... [15:31] AJ Brooks: the table is plenty big for everyone [15:31] Greowulf Spyker: Hey AJ - I got all three notices, FYI :-) [15:31] AJ Brooks: there will always be one more seat than person lol - yeah - I know - peopel probably get sick of my notices [15:31] Greowulf Spyker: not at all :-) [15:31] AJ Brooks: I hope to get our SL Education Roundtable group to a point where I don't ahve to do that so much [15:32] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: no--I'm just glad I was able to make this one [15:32] Zotarah Shepherd: I like that it is later [15:32] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: yes, I couldn't make the earlier ones [15:32] AJ Brooks: i've gotten pretty good feedback about the later hour we'll give folks another minute or two [15:33] Espin Carroll: Hi everybody, Hi RubyTuesday [15:33] AJ Brooks: we can play "what temperature is it where you are right now" lol [15:33] Lette Ponnier: hehe. hot. [15:33] AJ Brooks: 81.6 here - northern NJ [15:33] Katya Anatine: lol .. 95 [15:33] Zotarah Shepherd: Yes especially since it was hard to get inworld. [15:33] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: it keeps changing in Edinboro. PA--just south of Erie [15:33] Greowulf Spyker: 94 here [15:33] AJ Brooks: we'er just coming out of this terrible heat wave [15:33] Movies1963 Beck: in the 90's here [15:34] AJ Brooks: so much for spring [15:34] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: I'm in New Orleans. It's what we call warming up a little here. [15:34] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: We had storms and hail last night [15:34] Penelope Drucker: sumnmer in Iowa, hot and humid - what else? [15:34] Lette Ponnier: i think it's somewhere in the 80s here. definitely cooler than yesterday. [15:34] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: Low 90s, nothing to talk about yet [15:34] Josh1 Sands: OK don't be jealous the Rocky Mountain west today is in the 60's and sunny [15:34] AJ Brooks: i'm going to grab a water - brb [15:34] Zotarah Shepherd: It was so hot here yesterday I had to go see a movie. [15:34] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: woah. I'm jealous [15:34] Katya Anatine will move to the Rocky Mountains, then! [15:34] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: We're 10 days into hurricane season with nothing on the radars yet [15:34] Katya Anatine: got a job for me there? :) [15:34] Josh1 Sands: lol come on over [15:35] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: So, what happens here? [15:35] AJ Brooks: ok - back [15:35] Paribus Habilis whines: AJ... Lette keeps kicking me under the table! [15:36] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: k [15:36] AJ Brooks: lets rock and roll [15:36] Zotarah Shepherd: hehe [15:36] AJ Brooks: you know how we usually start - introeuce yourslef, you name, where you work, what you do - and no need to wait for everyone, just go ahead and type away we'll all catch up in chat history [15:36] Zotarah Shepherd: I am a MA in Education (technology and psychology) student at Sonoma State University in northern California working an a curriculum thesis project: Teaching and Learning Life-Skills in Second Life. [15:37] Paribus Habilis: Mike from Childrens Hospital Los Angeles -- IS Training group [15:37] Greowulf Spyker: I teach composition and business writing for Kaplan University and Seton Hall [15:37] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: I'm RichardSpeaker Zhaoying. I teach in teh College of Education and Human Development at the UNiversity of New ORleans [15:37] Josh1 Sands: Josh1Sands, retired Semantic/English teacher, Colorado [15:37] Professor Gloster: hi all - i'm from the University of Auckland in New Zealand and we're just setting up a new campus in sl [15:37] Penelope Drucker: 8th grade history and Language arts teacher, Muscatine, Iowa [15:37] AJ Brooks: I'm AJ Kelton, I'm the DIrector of Emerging Instructional Technology for the College of Humanities and Social Sciences (CHSS) at Montclair State University in Northern NJ [15:37] Lette Ponnier: I'm a Ph.D. student at Ohio State U, teaching Women's Studies [15:37] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I'm Donna Murphy in RL--a professor of Special Ed at Edinboro University of PA. My colleague--the Grad Dean--and I are trying to cinvince the powers that be that SL is a viable instructional environ [15:37] Irix Ladybird: Young researcher at the university of Sapienza, staff in the land Sardigna [15:37] Katya Anatine: Kathryn - I'm faculty at Saint Louis University, and teach literacy education and qualitative research methodology courses. [15:37] Echo Seigo: I'm Echo and I design presences inside SecondLife in the eudcation sector. [15:37] Zotarah Shepherd: I am taking a Spanish class taught by a teen on Eye4you. [15:37] Lette Ponnier: yes, Paribus. everything is coming through twice from you. [15:38] Sarah Handschuh: Teaching philosophy at a small liberal arts college in Indiana. [15:38] AJ Brooks: double posting Paribus [15:38] Zotarah Shepherd: Current project - interactive educational builds on Life-skills. Future plans - to have an island full of them for teachers and parents to explore. [15:38] Paribus Habilis will shut up and check for scripted objects... thanks all [15:38] AJ Brooks: Cordell! ok - well, thanks all for coming [15:38] Cordell McKinley: I'm Roger Greene - I teach a Teaching Online workshop for the Virginia Community Colleges - I teach technology at Mountain Empire Community College in Virginia [15:38] AJ Brooks: as you know, we meet every Tuesday [15:38] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I have an announcement==just learned about it a couple hours ago. Our presentation was accepted as a poster session at EDUCAUSSE in Orlando this Oct [15:39] Fim Fischer: Hi everyone. My name is M.A.Link, I am SL Developer. My team and I currently work on a Multiple Choice Test System. You can get a short impression at: http://www.manupool.com/trailer02.html - Feel free to ask me about the system :) [15:39] Espin Carroll: Im a teacher and now a student of postgrade, following a reserach about propectives versus realities about education in SL. Id like to stay and take notes, perhaps some phtos. Avatar names will not be recorded. I hope you give me permission to do this. [15:39] AJ Brooks: we just changed our times - pushed it back an hour [15:39] Josh1 Sands: np for me Espin [15:39] AJ Brooks: seems like its as good a tiem for folks as the earlier, so we'll keep with this [15:39] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: NP from me. [15:39] AJ Brooks: :-) [15:39] Professor Gloster: great for me - it's 10.30 in NZ [15:39] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: I may grab some images, too. [15:40] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Just don't record anything stupid I say [15:40] Josh1 Sands: go for it RichardSpeaker:) [15:40] AJ Brooks: there will be an official gtranscript [15:40] Espin Carroll: Hey: sorry: Im from Spain, here is 23:47 pm and 66F [15:40] AJ Brooks: I produce those and post them in the Dickson Hall Information Center [15:40] Zotarah Shepherd: ok with me [15:40] AJ Brooks: I am a few weeks behind but expect to get caught up before the end of the month [15:40] Espin Carroll: ty [15:40] AJ Brooks: As for taking notes - since this has come up before this is a public meeting and transcript is kept the only request is that if you are going to quote someone in something, that you write to them and ask permission first [15:41] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: So, I'll try not to be stupid thanks! [15:41] AJ Brooks: lol -= be as stupid as you want, Ruby I'm also noticing som chat lag so please keep that in mind when replying I'm a noob, as of Feb [15:41] AJ Brooks: welcome [15:41] Espin Carroll: blue people are not stupid at all :-) [15:41] AJ Brooks: so - another thing I'd like to ask is [15:42] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Are you the other bule avatar? I agree! [15:42] AJ Brooks: how did you find out about tonights meeting - if a list, which list, if a group, which group [15:42] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: SLED [15:42] Greowulf Spyker: Four different groups...lol [15:42] AJ Brooks: lol [15:42] Penelope Drucker: SLED [15:42] Lette Ponnier: RL educators in SL [15:42] AJ Brooks: I [15:42] Irix Ladybird: looking for educational groups [15:42] Professor Gloster: RLE and ISTE [15:42] AJ Brooks: I'm a shamless promoter [15:42] Greowulf Spyker: I appreciate it....easier to find you [15:42] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: SLED & ISTE [15:43] AJ Brooks: I hope you all find benefit from these meetings [15:43] Espin Carroll: ISTE [15:43] AJ Brooks: :-) [15:43] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I must say that I enjoy the give and take on SLED [15:43] Katya Anatine: I got it a few times too - it seemed more important that way :p [15:43] Cordell McKinley: CHSS, visitors group [15:43] AJ Brooks: this is how we work op[en forum if you have something you'd like to bring up, IM me - I mean, a whoel topic or an entire idea you are always welcome to respond to others I encourage it the point of these meetings are for an open exchange [15:44] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: First stupid thing: How do I IM you, if you are not my freind? [15:44] Fim Fischer: Ophelia, please take a seat... [15:44] AJ Brooks: You can do that through profile you'd look up ones profille and can IM through there [15:44] Lette Ponnier: or just right-click the person and select "send IM" if you're in the same place [15:44] AJ Brooks: :-) that too [15:44] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: thanks [15:44] AJ Brooks: lol congrats on educause presentation [15:45] Penelope Drucker: can I throuw out a question? [15:45] AJ Brooks: we will be having a Virtual Worlds CG meeting, hopefully you will come to that if you are AT Educause [15:45] AJ Brooks: I"m happy to provide information [15:45] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: thanks! We didn't think they'd acccept a prospectus--I won't start SL until this fall [15:45] AJ Brooks: go ahead, penelope [15:45] Penelope Drucker: thanks I teach 8th grade I am trying to get computeres in my classroom [15:46] Jennette Forager: Heres an empty seat [15:46] Penelope Drucker: a computer guy in town - our best and he is good!said that many urniveristies require their students to have computers and that after 4 years ro so get rid of them if this is true, any idea where they go? [15:46] Mercury Barnes: Let me tell you, as an aside, it's "wonderful" to be in the summer between jobs, winding down on one, no pressure from the other...:) [15:46] Penelope Drucker: I would live to get my hands on those [15:47] AJ Brooks: hmmm - we usually keep the discussion to SL issues. I'd say, if anyone has information to please IM Penelope - its an important qustion [15:47] Greowulf Spyker: at Seton Hall they recycle them to new students... [15:47] Penelope Drucker: I want to set my class as a model for ths distric oha sorry [15:47] AJ Brooks: s'ok :-) [15:47] Mercury Barnes: 97% of our undergrads show up with them, without telling them they need them. [15:47] Penelope Drucker: but the idea is to get them here I canot do that withough computers but yes [15:47] Zotarah Shepherd: I wish you all the best Penelope [15:47] Mercury Barnes: Seton Hall...? Recognize the name. [15:47] Penelope Drucker: please anyone who can help thnks [15:47] AJ Brooks: well - you'd need to get them onto the Teen Grid [15:48] Penelope Drucker: right [15:48] AJ Brooks: have you tried any of the SL grants [15:48] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: How about this segue: HOw do we get expwnsive computerw (that handle SL) into the hands of our students? [15:48] AJ Brooks: I thought I'd seen stuff from eye4u or global kids [15:48] Mercury Barnes: Grrrr, teen grid again -- this issue needs to be solved if only to keep it from consuming too much meeting and "hand-wringing" time...:) [15:48] Greowulf Spyker: I have a question.... [15:48] AJ Brooks: hang on gre [15:49] Zotarah Shepherd: Eye4you on the teen grid has space for classrooms. I can give you the website and names to ask. [15:49] AJ Brooks: i tink everyone would love to see it solved [15:49] Irix Ladybird: what is the matter with the teen grid? [15:49] Mercury Barnes: Have them buy a $399 DELL -- it's enough. [15:49] AJ Brooks: LOL right there are ways out there to get computers into schools [15:49] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Does it have the right graphics card? [15:49] AJ Brooks: especially k-12 Apple had a program at one time [15:49] Zotarah Shepherd: We just welcomed a new batch of students and teachers to Eye4you last week. [15:49] AJ Brooks: Rudy, don't believe it [15:50] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I am gulllible. sorry... [15:50] AJ Brooks: lol [15:50] Mercury Barnes: Nothing, except the damn law, so we're going to have to make a middle ground that absolves the Lindens and shifts the worry to the schools -- which is where it is already (most High Schools now have the "must check in at the office" requirement for visitors). [15:50] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: It's a serious concern. For our fall experiment, the grad dean is going to buy the computers [15:50] AJ Brooks: anyone have any information on grants or programs that schools can use to get comptuers - there is a ton of money floating aroudn SL for projects that are high impact, I thought but that won't last. [15:51] AJ Brooks gest Mercury a Zanex [15:51] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I had to buy my opwn computer in order to access SL [15:51] AJ Brooks: The teen grid didn't come up that way at this meeting [15:51] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: I'm a grant writer. I can help if people want to work together. [15:51] Mercury Barnes: Not sure where the Telco grants are (distant memory, but there was, likely still is, a program to fund -- search till your fingers bleed...:). [15:51] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: On what, Richard: computers? [15:52] AJ Brooks: lol [15:52] Mercury Barnes: It's money from the access charge (ancient law that never was repealed). [15:52] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: I've mostly had grants the help with integration of technology into various levels of teaching. [15:52] AJ Brooks: k-12 or higher ed - or both [15:52] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: The trick is always to match the project ot the right funding agency. I've done both, but mostly higher ed. [15:53] AJ Brooks: Greowulf, you had a question - sorry [15:53] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I'm distressed--MY colleague and i are gung=ho on integrations with SL, and are trying to convince the rest of the university.. [15:53] Mercury Barnes: But, considering the cost of most infrastructures (toilets zoom to 5k), a good presentation to the Dean can get "a half years salary recovery for a Prof that left" -- easily enough if done right...:) [15:53] Greowulf Spyker: np AJ - I can wait [15:53] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: But, we know the expense is a major drawback [15:53] AJ Brooks: Ruby, all you can do is keep plugging at SL and let peopel know what you are doing - they'll come over on their own, or the just won't for a long time it was me and me alone [15:54] Jennette Forager: Good point AJ [15:54] AJ Brooks: and now we have three islands, two colleges.... people value consistency [15:54] Katya Anatine: AJ, do your technology people support it too? [15:54] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I rhtink I realize that. But, at some level, I feel like I'm hiding a MAJOR drawback [15:54] AJ Brooks: to some degree - not actually "support" it, since that can mean so manyt hings [15:54] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: how will our students afford the upper-end computers? [15:54] AJ Brooks: but they did put it into our zen image for the teaching labs in my building an out public labs on campus one doesn't need an upper end computer to do this [15:55] Mercury Barnes: Yes, a consistent pleasant voice -- does seem to work AJ...:) [15:55] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: We need each student to have an appropriate computer--I'm tryijng to integrate SL into an online course [15:55] Greowulf Spyker: Oh, Ruby, we need to talk.... that's what I was looking into... [15:55] AJ Brooks: just let the students know in advnace what the technical requirements are [15:56] Irix Ladybird: that's interesting, rudy [15:56] AJ Brooks: if they don't like them, they can choose not to register [15:56] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I suppose if they buy desktops, rather than laptops, they can save some money [15:56] Greowulf Spyker: I was told there were snags to consider and wondered what they might be [15:56] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: But--aren't we then discriminating between those that have, and those that don't? [15:56] AJ Brooks: the priary computer for a student should be a laptop [15:56] Mercury Barnes: What we should do is work on the Open University in the UK to fund an SL connector in a serious way -- anyone else read the ECAR paper on the Moodle additions the OU did -- very strong arguments -- and $10 million to boot. if they can't take their comptuers with them - they won't work as much [15:57] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: If a laptop, then the expense for a graphically compatible model is steep [15:57] Greowulf Spyker: or at all in some cases, lol [15:57] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: We have three labs on camput that have Sl installed, but most of the students who take courses use their own computers [15:57] AJ Brooks: Rudy, peopel make choices all the time some choose nice sneakers some nice cell phones [15:57] Zotarah Shepherd: Have a fundraiser to create a computer lab or computers in your library. [15:57] AJ Brooks: some computers and have a place on campus where they can come if they don't have something at home [15:57] Jennette Forager: Mercury...you have a url for that paper? [15:57] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: woah--the difference in sneakers isin't thousands of dollare [15:58] Mercury Barnes: Students buy "Laptops as desktops" -- they buy them to "move to school, let them sit until break, then move them home" -- they do not carry them around -- the only thing that goes with them is the cellphone (why SL for cell phones is so important). [15:58] AJ Brooks: that wasn't the point - compueres aren't thousands of dollars either [15:58] Penelope Drucker: I ws recently told tht some universities require students to have a computer - consider part of ther college expense [15:58] Greowulf Spyker: not necessarily Mercury... It depends on the college [15:58] Mercury Barnes: Let me check -- your Univ will have to be an Educause member (most are -- accounts are easy). [15:58] AJ Brooks: i don't know where you work, Mercury, but I see studetns ewith computer ALL the time [15:58] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: One of the discussions on SLED is the expense of powerful laptops [15:58] Greowulf Spyker: Some profs require them brought to class [15:58] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: and the demand for upper-end graphics capability is only going to increase [15:58] Greowulf Spyker: :-) [15:59] Katya Anatine: and some profs request that students not use them in class :) [15:59] Greowulf Spyker: we use the projector for revision [15:59] Jennette Forager: and get cheaper..... (http://depts.washington.edu/isfuture/docs/ECAR-Convenience.pdf)??? [15:59] AJ Brooks: if you go into the student center [15:59] Greowulf Spyker: depends on what you're teaching Katya [15:59] AJ Brooks: you'll see students on computers [15:59] Mercury Barnes: http://net.educause.edu/ir/library/pdf/ecar_so/erb/ERB0812.pdf [15:59] AJ Brooks: if there is a coffee shop check it out, students on computers [15:59] Mercury Barnes: Bad name, great paper...:) [15:59] AJ Brooks: in the hallwyas of our buidlings [15:59] Greowulf Spyker: yes, AJ between classes [15:59] AJ Brooks: students on computer [15:59] Jennette Forager: (thanks) [16:00] AJ Brooks: I'm just refering back to Mercury saying studetns don't carry around comptuers [16:00] Professor Gloster: we have many students on computer [16:00] Greowulf Spyker: yes, I agree that they do, AJ [16:00] Mercury Barnes: Power just flickered here -- thank god for desktop UPS's...:) [16:00] Professor Gloster: computer access is required even to enroll [16:00] AJ Brooks: lol [16:00] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Is anyone here using SL for an online class? [16:00] Greowulf Spyker: trying to Ruby [16:00] Professor Gloster: we also have hot spots for internet access [16:00] Jennette Forager: One of my associates is [16:00] Greowulf Spyker: is that a segue? [16:00] AJ Brooks: online = 0 face to face, right? [16:00] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: We DO need to talk, Greowulf! [16:00] Jennette Forager: for Sociology [16:00] Fim Fischer: BTW, there is a company offering second life access thru mobile phones. (http://www.vollee.com/secondlife) Your students do not need a high end pc, they just need a dsl connection and a average laptop/pc or a mobile phone) .... [16:00] Katya Anatine: I've not run into a student who doesn't have a computer in years. [16:01] Lette Ponnier: Computer requirements are a class bias issue. I believe all students should have *access* to computers, but it's important not to reinforce structural differences among different economic classes of students. So... my question would be how do we get universities to put SL on at least some of the computers students can access? [16:01] Mercury Barnes: Works -- colleague has a phone "on the list" and can use it. [16:01] Greowulf Spyker: yikes [16:01] AJ Brooks: mine just did I asked - made the case - and they agreed put it on the zen image [16:01] Greowulf Spyker: most colleges/universities give a laptop to freshmen [16:01] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Well, I'm the person on SLED who complained about the tiny screens on mobile phones. And many of the grad students taking my online course are as old as me [16:01] Professor Gloster: yes that is the question - our it dept dosn't support sl [16:01] Mercury Barnes: Good question Lette -- any ideas? [16:01] AJ Brooks: its on all the teaching labs in my building and all of our public labs [16:02] Professor Gloster: and won't add to uni computers [16:02] AJ Brooks: what do they need to support? I know they say that - I just don't uenderstand it [16:02] Lette Ponnier: I'm pretty sure my university has some... Ohio State... because a colleague of mine has taught SL locally. [16:02] AJ Brooks: what is it they need to support? adding it to an image? [16:02] Lette Ponnier: But my university definitely does not give students computers, nor does it demand that students have computers of their own. [16:02] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: But, having those computers on campus is not useful for online classes [16:02] Professor Gloster: whtat i ment is that thay won't download the interface software onto uni computers [16:03] AJ Brooks: we don't etierh [16:03] Mercury Barnes: It's the "client turnover issue." -- sounds like someone in the IT Dept. is actually on SL and knows the client turnover issue -- it is a major support problem. [16:03] Katya Anatine: we don't give or require them either [16:03] Professor Gloster: and the students don't have access unless through their own comps [16:03] AJ Brooks: :-) I know Prof, I was being rehtorical - my rant was directed at them, not you. LOL [16:03] Greowulf Spyker: brb [16:03] AJ Brooks: I don't know why an IT department would take that stance - its backwards thinking IT departments are service providers there is nother wrong with that, either [16:04] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I'm learning that many IT departments are backwards. sorry [16:04] Mercury Barnes: Because they have limited budgets, and time -- I wouldn't support SL either. [16:04] AJ Brooks: I love my gas company [16:04] Professor Gloster: maybe that will change over time but the wheels turn slowly at a big inst [16:04] AJ Brooks: how big? we have 18+K [16:04] Mercury Barnes: Actually, they can turn fast, and it is an issue -- I wouldn't sanction SL for lab computers. [16:04] Professor Gloster: i don't know really - biggest in NZ [16:04] Katya Anatine: I can see why, AJ. SL requires so many updates ... IT doesn't want to allow students to be administrators of the computers - so IT would have to do all the updating. [16:04] AJ Brooks: sorry for railing on central IT departments, it just gets me crazy sometimes. Not all of them updates? when was the last required update? a month ago [16:05] Lette Ponnier: OSU is one of the biggest in the U.S. (as in top 2), and we have an SL presence here... though probably not in computer labs. [16:05] AJ Brooks: when before then? 6 or 7 months? [16:05] Mercury Barnes: My wife is Central IT, I'm College -- we both understand, intimately, the issues. [16:05] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I think ours would be more supportive, if the admin can be convinced... [16:05] Irix Ladybird: no, aj....there has been a period of very frequent updates required [16:05] AJ Brooks: It also depends a lot on the mentality of the IT department only on the first look viewer [16:05] Mercury Barnes: I love SL, but wouldn't sanction it. [16:06] AJ Brooks: there have not been REQUIRED updates very frequently at all [16:06] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: What do you mean, Mercury? [16:06] AJ Brooks: one abotu a month ago - and another about 7 months ago - the others were voluntary [16:06] Mercury Barnes: The updates have been very disruptive -- IT Depts can handle maybe one update a semester. [16:06] Katya Anatine: to IT I think that might be a lot. [16:06] Zotarah Shepherd: It does not take all that long to download a new SL update. [16:07] AJ Brooks: its 340m - give me a break windows updates are nothing compared to that [16:07] Mercury Barnes: The download is nothing...:) [16:07] AJ Brooks: and IT departmetns do them routinetly [16:07] Mercury Barnes: It's the new image, the training, the testing...:) [16:07] AJ Brooks: please the new image takes 15 minutes [16:07] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Yah. I;m of two minds about SL as well, I think it is a spectacular platofrm, but I'm not sure it's viable for broad-based university applications. Too many changes, and too many, uhm, poor students [16:08] Mercury Barnes: Windows download has a client. I've argued extensively that SL should do something similar. [16:08] AJ Brooks: and what taining? for hwhome? SL is a tool [16:08] Mercury Barnes: Clearly, you've never cast out an update AJ...:) [16:08] AJ Brooks: like any other tool like books and videos [16:08] Lette Ponnier: it might depend on exactly how many computers we're talking about. if SL is available on a limited number of computers, updates are doable. if we're talking about every computer on campus, it might become troublesome at a school with multiple computer labs. [16:08] AJ Brooks: and other pedagogical tools [16:08] Irix Ladybird: sl in not a tool....it is an environment [16:08] Professor Gloster: we're moving to outside apps more and more and getting students to be more self reliant [16:08] AJ Brooks: well - we'll have to disagree on that [16:09] Irix Ladybird: if we consider it like a tool...we cannot think of any new perspective in education [16:09] Jennette Forager: the bandwidth required is an issue as well [16:09] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: And, Lette--if we consider online, distant students, we have a major problems [16:09] Greowulf Spyker: I'm back...and i disagree as well [16:09] Movies1963 Beck: Irix why do you think SL is not an educational tool? [16:09] AJ Brooks: I disagree with you on that as well, Irix [16:09] Lette Ponnier: in what way, Ruby? [16:09] Mercury Barnes: I've managed labs with hundreds of machines (biggest ones on campus). [16:09] Zotarah Shepherd: If SL is on networked computers can't you just do an update once for all of them? [16:09] Professor Gloster: so i think that shortly students will need their own comps and most other things [16:09] Greowulf Spyker: a tool is anything that functions as an aid - SL qualifies [16:09] Zotarah Shepherd: SL is an educational too. [16:09] AJ Brooks: managed properly - the updates should be no problem [16:09] Irix Ladybird: it depends on how you consider a "tool" [16:10] AJ Brooks: toss them onto one image - and then zen them down, or whatever zen-like tool a school usees [16:10] Mercury Barnes: SL is getting close -- this Spring has been the best I've seen -- only 1 required update. [16:10] Irix Ladybird: I think of mcluhan's definition [16:10] Greowulf Spyker: semantics, Irix [16:10] Movies1963 Beck: I consider a tool anything I can use to aid me in what I'm trying to do [16:10] AJ Brooks: and one in the fall only [16:10] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Because they don't have access to university computers, which ITs can (or cannot) update. They must buy their own, expensive computers, and deal with the updates individually [16:10] AJ Brooks: last summer was when the multipolce requireds stopped right after SLCC [16:10] Kavon Zenovka: Zotarah - for updates you should just be able to update the image. [16:10] Irix Ladybird: SL is not just an instrument that we use for some purpose [16:10] AJ Brooks: of course it is [16:11] Mercury Barnes: Expensive compared to tuition, no, most kids are showing up on campus with better machines than the labs. [16:11] Lette Ponnier: yes, i agree, Ruby. though that's going to be a problem with distance learning regardless of the platform. it's not specific to SL. [16:11] Professor Gloster: most students are pretty it literate with facebook, bloggs etc. [16:11] Irix Ladybird: like other "media" it has some effect on us [16:11] Movies1963 Beck: why isn't it? [16:11] Greowulf Spyker: why not Irix? [16:11] Professor Gloster: is facebook a tool [16:11] AJ Brooks: yes it can be [16:11] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: And I've been involved in distance learning since 2001. Our experimental program this fall involves online students [16:11] Professor Gloster: i agree that they are environments for education, entertainments, communication [16:11] AJ Brooks: everythign looks like a nail when all you ahve is a hammer [16:11] Greowulf Spyker: Ruby, we do need to talk.. [16:11] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I'm very concerned about what happens AFTER the trial semester, when we buy their computers for them [16:12] Mercury Barnes: Distance learning is the main reason for using SL -- build presence and "connection" -- I heartily recommend it for this. [16:12] Irix Ladybird: i mean, it not simply a tool... it has a lot of consequences - interesting conseguences - on our way oh thinking and using it [16:12] AJ Brooks: not just distance learning, though hybrid classes [16:12] Professor Gloster: but nowadays many things are 'distance' even if you're just down the hall [16:12] AJ Brooks: or blended pick your term lol - right [16:12] Mercury Barnes: Yes. [16:12] AJ Brooks: students in their dorms [16:12] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Yes==I understand that intuitively. But now, as we are faced with reality, I'm seeing huge problems [16:13] Irix Ladybird: that's the point ;) [16:13] Professor Gloster: i skype my boss in the office next door [16:13] AJ Brooks: lol so - what does the word hybrid mean? [16:13] Mercury Barnes: Peak time for LMS usage is 12:00 pm to 2:00 am -- we have a generation of "night flyers" upon us. [16:13] Greowulf Spyker: my husband IM's me from another room [16:13] Professor Gloster: my backsides getting larger though - a drawback! [16:13] AJ Brooks: ROFL - prof! [16:13] Mercury Barnes: So does my Greowulf...:) [16:13] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: :D [16:14] Lette Ponnier: and my RL students IM each other from opposite sides of the classroom :P [16:14] AJ Brooks: ok - hang on one second everyone - hold on [16:14] Lette Ponnier: yay technology [16:14] AJ Brooks: there has GOT to be someone here who has not said something yet [16:14] Greowulf Spyker: cheese! [16:14] AJ Brooks: so how about someone who HASN"T spoken up - saying something [16:14] Mercury Barnes: AJ's naming of this generation fits...:) [16:14] Kavon Zenovka: sorry - came late [16:14] Greowulf Spyker: may I ask my Q? [16:14] AJ Brooks: The Opposible Generatin - or Generation O [16:14] Kavon Zenovka: so I'm not sure what the main question was about SL as a tool [16:14] AJ Brooks: thats what I call them Greowulf - hit it [16:15] Cordell McKinley: something? [16:15] Mercury Barnes: :) [16:15] AJ Brooks: Gre? [16:15] Greowulf Spyker: ok, I'm trying to incorporate SL into my online class at Seton Hall [16:15] AJ Brooks: YEAH _ NJ!!!!!!!! [16:15] Greowulf Spyker: but I was told that there are complications [16:15] AJ Brooks: (sorry) [16:15] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Well, Al--if you mean opposible, as in opositional, that's probably true. If yo mean opposible, as in thumbs, that's another... [16:15] Greowulf Spyker: I was wondering what those might be [16:15] Kavon Zenovka: what complications? [16:16] Greowulf Spyker: yes, that's my question and who's on first.... [16:16] AJ Brooks: using it in what capacity [16:16] Greowulf Spyker: lol [16:16] AJ Brooks: (opposible as in thumbs) [16:16] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Who told you there were problems? Can you ask that person to be specific? [16:16] Kavon Zenovka: so - you haven't been told by your IT or adminstration that there will be complications [16:16] AJ Brooks: game boy - text mssg [16:16] Greowulf Spyker: ok, I teach through Blackboard [16:16] Penelope Drucker: tech complicatoins? user complications? [16:16] Greowulf Spyker: but was thinking of having synchronous seminars in SL [16:16] AJ Brooks: ewww [16:16] Greowulf Spyker: once a week [16:16] Mercury Barnes: Managing identity can be a pain -- asking every student to send you their SL identity, and local campus identity, to connect the dots is an issue (not for 10, serious for 1000). [16:16] AJ Brooks: SL is not FERPA compliant [16:17] Greowulf Spyker: AHHHH [16:17] Cordell McKinley: I teach through blackboard and I'm experimenting with SL as office hours [16:17] Greowulf Spyker: what's Ferpa? [16:17] AJ Brooks: SL is NOT a substitute for an LMS [16:17] Kavon Zenovka: open or closed campus? [16:17] AJ Brooks: Federal Educationl somethign Protection Act [16:17] Mercury Barnes: Perfect use for SL Cordell...:) [16:17] Philled Graves: FERPA is a privacy act protecting student information [16:17] Katya Anatine: oooh .. hadn't thought of FERPA> Can you elaborate, AJ? [16:17] Greowulf Spyker: so in simpler terms? [16:17] AJ Brooks: it is the US Fedearl Law that say you can't give studetn info to anyone other than the student [16:17] Greowulf Spyker: yes, please [16:17] AJ Brooks: including a parent over 18 of course [16:17] Philled Graves: and if you get th students to self-declar inforamtion you can bypass FERPA [16:17] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: Wait, keeping track of avatars and student names just takes a list like in my excell grading system. [16:17] Greowulf Spyker: so SL interferes with this? [16:17] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: That's not a major problem [16:18] AJ Brooks: you can't share grades with studetns via SL [16:18] Greowulf Spyker: U of NC holds classes in SL [16:18] AJ Brooks: or discussion priave information [16:18] Greowulf Spyker: I sat through one it was a nursing class [16:18] Mercury Barnes: One-offs with 30 kids are easy for SL -- 5,000 courses for 40,000 kids, changing schedules constantly, is not. [16:18] Katya Anatine: I guess if you use some other system for grades, etc, SL is ok, re: FERPA? [16:18] Kavon Zenovka: IF you are already compliant with FERPA in RL you just carry those practices over to SL [16:18] Greowulf Spyker: so I can't expect to pilot this I guess [16:18] AJ Brooks: i can't think of why else it might be a problem one class [16:19] Kavon Zenovka: why not? [16:19] AJ Brooks: not true, Kavon [16:19] Greowulf Spyker: I thought it might be other issues w regard to getting them online in SL.... [16:19] Kavon Zenovka: what specific FERPA problems ddo you see in SL [16:19] Greowulf Spyker: or recording the seminars [16:19] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Totally off-subject. For our report to the admin, I need to give examples of how SL is unique in what can be offered instructionally. Anyone have a good resourcefor this? [16:19] AJ Brooks: the LMS from your school is secure for information, in theory - you cant' say the same about LL servers [16:19] Jennette Forager: the interactivity here is a good report on it's way out.... [16:19] AJ Brooks: 101 Uses of SL in the College Classroom by Meghan Conklin [16:19] Philled Graves: start with AJ's paper for ECAR [16:19] Greowulf Spyker: please...define LMS and LL? sorry [16:20] AJ Brooks: from ELON University [16:20] Zotarah Shepherd: Interactive and collective building [16:20] Kavon Zenovka: so - don't put up grades and identifying student information in SL [16:20] Mercury Barnes: That's the issue Ruby -- try selling the "presence and connection" abilities of SL to Admins.. [16:20] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Great ideas. I'll follow up. thx [16:20] AJ Brooks: Learning Management System (blackboard), LL = linden labs [16:20] Greowulf Spyker: ok thanks [16:20] AJ Brooks: yes, Kevon, thats the way its possible thanks for the pliug, Philled :-) I'll write you that check right now [16:20] Philled Graves: you can slip me $5 later [16:21] AJ Brooks: lol [16:21] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: why is my avatar typing away, while I am not, in RL??? [16:21] AJ Brooks: Hey - there is a major issue of EDUCAUSE REVIEW coming out in the late summer [16:21] Philled Graves: seriously though, it is a good starting point for dialog with Admins on applicability [16:21] AJ Brooks: Its Called Back to (Virtual) School [16:21] Mercury Barnes: Try filling the hole of "interactive and spontaneous discussion" for a language learning course in something other than SL -- almost impossible, but easy for SL. [16:21] Jennette Forager: http://learningfromsocialworlds.wordpress.com/learning-to-teach-in-second-life/ [16:21] Kavon Zenovka: interesting title AJ - have you seen an advance [16:21] Fada Gustafson is Online [16:22] Irix Ladybird: interesting, Aj [16:22] AJ Brooks: its is being written now I'm one of the authors, along with Intellagirl Tully, Fleep Tuque [16:22] Kavon Zenovka: Just want to know just in case the questiosn from the admins start flying. [16:22] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I've got to ocnvince them that a grad special ed methods cours ein ireading will be enhanced. I've ocnsidereed ty benefits of role-playing... [16:22] AJ Brooks: and two others [16:22] Kavon Zenovka: okay - then I'm not so worried. [16:22] AJ Brooks: The EDUCAUSE REVIEW's major audience is Presidents CIOs CTOs [16:22] Irix Ladybird: do you think that language learning can be the killer application for SL, then, mercury? [16:22] AJ Brooks: Provosts [16:23] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Ah!!! can you get me an advance copy, AL? [16:23] AJ Brooks: THAT will be a good thing to point Administrators to [16:23] Kavon Zenovka: okay - ours have accepted it so far [16:23] AJ Brooks: I'm afriad I can't [16:23] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: damn [16:23] AJ Brooks: I can't even get myself one - lol [16:23] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: sorry [16:23] Mercury Barnes: Role playing is good here, big focus on sex, less on violence, and even less on "fantasy," but it is here and does work. [16:23] Kavon Zenovka: The Deans seem to have more problems with SL [16:23] AJ Brooks: And the upper-ups have already come to trust the EDUCAUSE brand so it will give great credibility [16:24] Kavon Zenovka: true [16:24] Greowulf Spyker: upper=ups - I like that [16:24] Mercury Barnes: Then do office hours and "not required" discussion and see what develops. [16:24] Kavon Zenovka: Thank you for doing it. [16:24] AJ Brooks: EDUCAUSE is embracing vws in a major way [16:24] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I don't think my upper-uos know what ECUCAUSE is.. [16:24] AJ Brooks: higher ed? for k-12 its ISTE higher ed its EDUCAUSE http://www.educause.edu [16:24] Mercury Barnes: The "general discussion and chatting" aspects tend to get the highest comments and remarks from instructors (and no, I can't point you to a study, sorry...:) i'm sure they do - EDUCAUSE runs the .edu domain [16:25] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Actually, Mercury--my synchronous office hour chat for online classes is always heavily attended [16:25] AJ Brooks: Folks, our time is almost up [16:25] Greowulf Spyker: that's great Ruby, no shows up for mine...:-) they all email me [16:25] AJ Brooks: Like past Roundtables, tonights did not disappoint, I hope we meet each week - on Tuesday here [16:26] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I work with a cohort, so it's a bonding experience [16:26] Jennette Forager: been great AJ, thanks! [16:26] Mercury Barnes: :) -- another comment for me to remember and utter unreferenced -- thanks...:) [16:26] AJ Brooks: from 3:30pm to 4:30pm [16:26] Espin Carroll: Sorry, a message to everybody: As I mentioned before Im doing a postgrade research on SL. Please those of you willing to help with a short questionnaire, say "me", Ill IM you the questionnaire. Thanks a lot. [16:26] Professor Gloster: good to know [16:26] Jennette Forager: me [16:26] Professor Gloster: thanks [16:26] AJ Brooks: feel free to stay and chat [16:26] Zotarah Shepherd: me [16:26] RichardSpeaker Zhaoying: Thanks [16:26] Kavon Zenovka: me [16:26] AJ Brooks: I'm not going anywhere just yet [16:26] Irix Ladybird: me [16:26] Fim Fischer: me [16:26] Espin Carroll: Thnaks a lot AJ [16:26] Cordell McKinley: Thanks AJ [16:26] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: do i need to be teaching in SL, Espin? [16:26] AJ Brooks: but for those who planned to leave at 4:30pm, when the meeting ended, feel free to do wso without guilt :-) [16:26] Mercury Barnes: That's what I believe SL is best for Ruby -- bonding...:) content will come...:) [16:26] AJ Brooks: community [16:26] Penelope Drucker: thank you AJ :D [16:27] Espin Carroll: no, Ruby,no need [16:27] AJ Brooks: COmmunity is SO important [16:27] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I agree. But I think, unless you've actually experienced it, it's hard to understand that's what this report we're devleoping is all about [16:27] Cordell McKinley: that's true Ruby [16:27] Fim Fischer: Thx AJ :-) [16:27] Mercury Barnes: Agreed Ruby. [16:27] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: then, me, also, Espin [16:27] AJ Brooks: I think those who are experiences are charged with bringing those who are not into the fold, so to speak [16:27] Espin Carroll: k, ty :-) [16:27] Irix Ladybird: that's my experience, ruby [16:27] AJ Brooks: mentors its an important part of being in the community [16:28] Lette Ponnier: me, Espin [16:28] Irix Ladybird: my professors laugh at me, when I talk about SL [16:28] AJ Brooks: we always help those who follow behind us [16:28] Irix Ladybird: they simply don't know it.... but they judge [16:28] AJ Brooks: as we were helped by those who came before - at least that has been my experience here [16:28] Katya Anatine: My students laugh at me when I mention SL :) [16:28] AJ Brooks: they will laugh now [16:28] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: when my colleague, the Dean of Grad Studies, brought it up in the admin council meeting, they laughed at him... [16:28] Cordell McKinley: I get about 3 out of 20 I bring in to see what I see - the potential [16:28] AJ Brooks: but in a few years - they won't be laughing anymore [16:28] Philled Graves: Irix, i had the exact oposite reaction, in my grad program, my faculty encouraged me to find applications for this among other social media [16:28] AJ Brooks: you will be the visionary [16:28] Mercury Barnes: Get voice Ruby, come to the Ahern Welcome center -- and I'll introduce you to the "SL that most come for" -- at least the entry point...:) [16:29] Greowulf Spyker: I brought up SL and somebody said "I don't have time for games" [16:29] AJ Brooks: Anyone going to SLCC in Tampa? [16:29] Irix Ladybird: but it's so hard now... [16:29] Mercury Barnes: Educause in Oct.. [16:29] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: k, Mercury [16:29] Irix Ladybird: that's great, philled [16:29] Cordell McKinley: the "game mindset" is a common reaction [16:29] AJ Brooks: that too shall pass [16:29] Mercury Barnes: Raucous, messy, crude, rude, but real...:) [16:29] Philled Graves: if you would like to compare notes, or need fodder for debate, i'm happy to help you work through some of that [16:29] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I just heard that our President expects much better graphics capabilites than SL provides [16:29] AJ Brooks: nobody going to SLCC? [16:30] Greowulf Spyker: said the termite to his constipated friend.... [16:30] Kavon Zenovka: Everyone who does use SL cringes when they hear someone call it a game. [16:30] Katya Anatine: I'd love to see SL-themed proposals at "regular" conferences. we should network for that. [16:30] AJ Brooks: they have a GREAT edu track this year [16:30] Zotarah Shepherd: And SL needs all the good press it can get. [16:30] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: Don't know who he thinks is going to pay for the machines, even if SL had those advanced graphics [16:30] AJ Brooks: there have been – many I've done several [16:30] Philled Graves: i'm trying to convince my college in to both letting me go and paying for it [16:30] Irix Ladybird: right katya [16:30] Fim Fischer: Thx for the fruitful meeting. Bye everyone. [16:30] AJ Brooks: and there will be some this year at EDUCAUSE in orlando [16:30] Philled Graves: slcc THAT IS [16:30] Katya Anatine: not at any I've attended, that I know of [16:30] Fim Fischer: *waves* [16:30] Mercury Barnes: Machine costs are ultimately trivial to people and instutional costs...:) [16:30] Katya Anatine: So those of you who have ... we should network [16:30] Irix Ladybird: i have to go now thank you for the interesting debate! [16:31] Mercury Barnes: Yes, thanks. [16:31] Irix Ladybird: hope we'll keep in touch, somehow [16:31] AJ Brooks: yw - please come again you folks can join our group SL EDUCATION ROUNDTABLE [16:31] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: wonderful first experience. thx! [16:31] Lette Ponnier: take care, all. this has been interesting. [16:31] AJ Brooks: if you cant' find it - it sin my profile - or ask me for an invite anyone else? [16:32] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: uhm....are we dismissed? [16:32] AJ Brooks: lol - have you eaten all your veggies [16:32] Katya Anatine: Thanks all - hope to see everyone again. [16:32] Zotarah Shepherd: lol [16:32] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: haven't had dinner yet... [16:32] Zotarah Shepherd: Thanks AJ [16:32] AJ Brooks: I tend to stick around until most peple are gone bye Z [16:32] Cordell McKinley: gn AJ I have astudetn in my SL office - lol [16:33] AJ Brooks: later cordell [16:33] Zotarah Shepherd: I have a build to work on on the TG. [16:33] Kavon Zenovka: thank you [16:33] AJ Brooks: yw kavon [16:33] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I do that with my synchronous office hour. I refuse to leave until everyone else does. Sometimes I have to order them to go to bed [16:33] AJ Brooks: lol - I know my class was like that too always stayed over classtime [16:34] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: I think they enjoy the bonding--especially if it's light-hearted [16:34] AJ Brooks: yes ya know - we stopped telling kids it was fun to learn in - kindergarden I think after that its been work work work wrok wrok [16:34] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: And, by the time we meet (around 8PM), my ritalin has worn off, so it's pretty lively [16:34] AJ Brooks: so of course there is some resitatnce to the idea that learning actually can be fun [16:35] Philled Graves kicks AJ under the table [16:35] Espin Carroll: thats very right AJ [16:35] AJ Brooks: OUCH [16:35] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: someone needs ot show me how to do that AJ? [16:35] AJ Brooks: do what? [16:35] Philled Graves: add a /me before your phrase [16:35] Greowulf Spyker: now that it's quieter....AJ do you see potential problems with running a seminar in SL (optional) in conjunction with my BB course? [16:35] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: kick someone under the table [16:35] AJ Brooks: oh - put /me in front of what you want to say [16:35] Espin Carroll: lol [16:35] AJ Brooks: liek this says hi to Ruby [16:35] Movies1963 Beck: have a good evening everyone [16:35] AJ Brooks: g/night Movies [16:36] Zotarah Shepherd waves Bye to everyone. [16:36] Red: I hear you [16:36] AJ Brooks: later Z hopes Rudy is going to try it [16:36] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: well, I guess I should go work on my two online classes. Night, all. [16:36] Sarah Handschuh: I need to scoot. This was my first time here, and found the conversation quite helpful. Thanks for hosting this AJ. [16:36] Greowulf Spyker: actually it's Ruby, AJ [16:36] AJ Brooks: excellent - please come again [16:37] Espin Carroll: next meetings will be announced via ISTE group? [16:37] AJ Brooks: every week here from 3:30pm to 4:30pm [16:37] Espin Carroll: k [16:37] Greowulf Spyker: oh no, Ruby has passed out... [16:37] AJ Brooks: sometimes I run out of time to do the group IMs or have trouble posting the [16:38] Greowulf Spyker: glad you're ok Ruby [16:38] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: jeeze--that wa a lot of text to copy and paste... [16:38] AJ Brooks: lol it was a great conversation [16:38] Philled Graves: yes it was glad i managed to drop in today [16:38] AJ Brooks: i was a bit more vocal tonight than I normall am [16:38] RubyTuesday Ballyhoo: night, all! I mean it, this time [16:38] Greowulf Spyker: yeah, I didn't feel like I got a real answer though....:-( [16:38] AJ Brooks waves at Ruby [16:39] Greowulf Spyker: Still feel timid about stepping into SL with my online class don't know what pitfalls to expect [16:39] AJ Brooks: well - its hard to tell test the waters first make it a 1/2 class thing have them sign up using NMCs form [16:40] Greowulf Spyker: NMC? [16:40] AJ Brooks: and then NMCs orientation island (much better than SL's) [16:40] Philled Graves: there are all kinds of gloom and doom stuff... connectivity, literacy to start... you'll also run into arguments about accesiblity and confidentality, and identity management [16:40] AJ Brooks: Ne Media Consortium they are doing a workshop at Seton Hall later this year [16:40] Greowulf Spyker: ah, yes, they're always on campus [16:40] AJ Brooks: Talk to Heidi about it [16:40] Greowulf Spyker: I teach online for many reasons [16:40] AJ Brooks: yo hate your studetns? LOL - just kidding [16:41] Philled Graves: Espin.. i'll work through your questionaire and return asap [16:41] Greowulf Spyker: exactly - how'd you know? LOL [16:41] Philled Graves: likely this evening [16:41] AJ Brooks: lol [16:41] Espin Carroll: Bye. thanks again [16:41] AJ Brooks waves at Espin poof [16:41] Greowulf Spyker: it's my hideous pig face....it works against me [16:41] AJ Brooks: i meant to talk to you about that [16:41] Greowulf Spyker: I'm not that close, driving down there's tough lol [16:42] AJ Brooks: tenured? [16:42] Greowulf Spyker: no not at all not even cured... [16:42] Philled Graves: lol [16:42] Greowulf Spyker: kidding [16:42] AJ Brooks: lol [16:42] Greowulf Spyker: just an adjunct [16:42] AJ Brooks: just? how could any school survive without adjuncts [16:43] Philled Graves: in the current fiscal climates they can't [16:43] Greowulf Spyker: true, but I seem to always be looking up the full-timers noses [16:43] AJ Brooks: well - its that tenure thing its like the matrix take the blue pill - and go back to being a normal human take the red pill - and become a tenured faculty member lol [16:44] Philled Graves: spend your time looking for the 'any key' and end up a full time geek in academia [16:44] Greowulf Spyker: yup I'm not much into posturing [16:44] AJ Brooks: lol dont' tell anyone but I use the control key instead of the any key, and it works [16:45] Philled Graves: lol [16:45] AJ Brooks: must be a bug [16:45] Greowulf Spyker: yeah, nah....not at this point [16:45] Philled Graves: true story... i had one of those when i was in sales while working my way through my BA [16:45] Greowulf Spyker: I like my freedom....too bad I'm poor though [16:45] Philled Graves: nobody goes in to academia to get rich [16:45] Greowulf Spyker: although I did go for that Creative Writing gig at MSU [16:45] AJ Brooks: no indeed speaking of which, hows the new job? [16:46] Philled Graves: new job is good thanks lots to do [16:46] Greowulf Spyker: ok, night all.... [16:46] Philled Graves: g'nite Greowulf [16:46] AJ Brooks: our english department is whacked [16:46] Philled Graves: please feel free to ping me if i can be of any value [16:46] AJ Brooks: the biggest bunch of loonies on the planet [16:46] Greowulf Spyker: reallY? [16:46] AJ Brooks: i know, I'm a product [16:46] Greowulf Spyker: cool [16:46] AJ Brooks: both degrees ba and ma [16:46] Greowulf Spyker: I like Loons [16:46] Philled Graves: isn't that a pre-req for english [16:46] AJ Brooks: well - I'm being kind [16:46] Philled Graves: mind you my ex has her phd in english [16:47] AJ Brooks: its not such a great place to work, some tell me [16:47] Greowulf Spyker: too many egos? [16:47] AJ Brooks: very contentious [16:47] Greowulf Spyker: what's up with that? [16:47] AJ Brooks: old school v new school [16:47] Philled Graves: infighting is so fierce becasue the stakes are so small? [16:47] Greowulf Spyker: creative people should be down to earth and open minded evolved even [16:47] AJ Brooks: well - many in that department are not many are [16:47] Greowulf Spyker: so there's hope then.... [16:47] AJ Brooks: we have some WILDLY talented people but they get shouted down all the time 80/20 rule [16:48] Philled Graves: that's a shame [16:48] Greowulf Spyker: yeah, freedom is good [16:48] Philled Graves: but too often reality [16:48] AJ Brooks: lol - yeah [16:48] Greowulf Spyker: ok, dinner and kids call :-) [16:48] AJ Brooks: later Greowulf thans for coming [16:49] Greowulf Spyker: thanks for having me [16:49] AJ Brooks: hope to see you again [16:49] Greowulf Spyker: see you next week barring child illnesses :-) [16:49] AJ Brooks: :) i better think about dinner its almost 8pm and I'm exhausted [16:49] Philled Graves: kk [16:49] Philled Graves: beat it [16:49] AJ Brooks: I talked for over 5 hours today [16:49] Philled Graves: i have to dash off to a meeting we should catch up some time soon [16:50] AJ Brooks: I'm running a two day hybrid/online workshop for our faclty [16:50] Philled Graves: cool [16:50] AJ Brooks: yeah goes with the new title [16:50] Philled Graves: fun [16:50] AJ Brooks: and today was blackboard and SL tomorrow is iTunesU and social netwrking ad media that should be fun I'm going to get them all twittering lol [16:51] Philled Graves: very cool [16:51] AJ Brooks: and n facebook and bloggin and wikis [16:51] Philled Graves: you animal you [16:51] AJ Brooks: and making pod and vido casts [16:51] AJ Brooks: lol grrrrr lol [16:51] Philled Graves: would love to see your outline i'm in talks with our Assit Dean of Distance Ed about exploring SL in earnest [16:51] AJ Brooks: sure [16:52] Philled Graves: okay get out of here i need too [16:52] AJ Brooks: ok [16:52] Philled Graves: but i'm going to do Espin's questionaire first [16:52] AJ Brooks: i'll send the outline [16:52] Philled Graves: great [16:52] AJ Brooks: if I rmember – lol If I don't ping me about it [16:52] Philled